Sincronos.net Forums

Sincronos.net Forums

Nothing is permanent, everything is constant.
 
It is currently Tue Aug 14, 2018 2:52 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 29 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Who are you planning to vote for, or who would you vote for if you could?
Hillary R. Clinton 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Donald J. Trump 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Fuck Me Runnin' 100%  100%  [ 2 ]
Total votes : 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:12 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
Well, since the nominations are pretty much officially official, now...


_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:41 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 6:31 am
Posts: 1054
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Well, we've known for months who the Republican nominee was going to be. I was hoping that maybe Clinton would be indicted after that e-mail scandal, and in a half-way sane democracy she would have been. :x

Quite frankly, America has elected the nominees that it deserves. Your entire political culture is a toxic disgrace.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 1:36 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:24 am
Posts: 946
Location: Oregon, USA
snowman1989 wrote:
Quite frankly, America has elected the nominees that it deserves.
Heehee! Thanks, I needed the laugh.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:27 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
Since I can't think of a more appropriate place to put it, this pretty much summarized the third night of the Republican National Convention in Cleveland:

Image

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:58 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
Well, in exactly three weeks, the godforsaken nightmare that has been Campaign 2016 will finally be over, only to be immediately followed by the (at least) four-year nightmare of Clinton II: The Revenge. And the long-predicted, inevitable and continuing Trumplosion, which already threatens to reach the necessary mass to create a self-sustaining singularity, will give birth to Trump TV.

Image

#NEGAN/LUCILLE 2016.

Also, how is it that FMR has only garnered two votes in this poll?!

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2016 12:33 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
Well, the interminable farce of this campaign is nearly over. Of course, after that we'll have to face a new nightmare, and I don't mean the war against the machines. But at least delusion will finally be forced to give way to reality, in at least some quarters.

I've maintained from the beginning that Trump's nomination made Clinton's election inevitable. I elaborated upon that just now in a Facebook reply which I'll repost here for posterity, and in case anyone else wants to weigh in on it...also, if I end up being wrong, you can forever link back to it to spite me. :P
CWS wrote:
Trump's entire campaign has basically been aimed at three groups: poorly informed retirees, alt-right fringe zealots, and the crossover Democrats who helped get him through the Republican primaries...for the sole purpose of making sure Clinton's opponent in the general would be the only candidate she could possibly defeat. Meanwhile, he has not only alienated but actively shunned the traditional, conservative Republican base.

Failing to sufficiently mobilize the base is kind of a big deal. For reference, see President McCain and President Romney. And all they did was fail to inspire the base, they didn't spend an entire year going out of their way to actually insult us at every possible opportunity, which is what Trump and all of his surrogates have spent their entire campaign doing.

You may have heard of the #NeverTrump movement within the Republican party. Is there a #NeverHillary movement within the Democrat party? No, there is not. That should tell you all you really need to know.

Ironically, Trump is right when he says this election was rigged. But it is his own candidacy that has rigged it. Clinton won the minute he secured the nomination, everything since then has essentially been theatre. That this has ever been a close race is actually a reflection of just how bad a candidate she really is, that even a cartoon character like Trump could have "potentially" had a shot at her.

Anyone else -- ANYONE else, except perhaps Jeb Bush, or Christie, or Carson -- would have spent the past few months kicking her ass from coast to coast.

Of course, I could always be wrong, and we'll know in two days. But this is what a quarter-century of political study has taught me.

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 2:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 6:31 am
Posts: 1054
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
CWS wrote:
Well, the interminable farce of this campaign is nearly over. Of course, after that we'll have to face a new nightmare, and I don't mean the war against the machines. But at least delusion will finally be forced to give way to reality, in at least some quarters.


....................................................



CWS wrote:
I've maintained from the beginning that Trump's nomination made Clinton's election inevitable. I elaborated upon that just now in a Facebook reply which I'll repost here for posterity, and in case anyone else wants to weigh in on it...also, if I end up being wrong, you can forever link back to it to spite me. :P


No, I think Trump being elected and smashing your entire worldview and faith in America is more than punishment enough. :? I think this here video sums up my current mood well enough, for you it'll be all too fitting.



Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:08 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
snowman1989 wrote:
CWS wrote:
I've maintained from the beginning that Trump's nomination made Clinton's election inevitable. I elaborated upon that just now in a Facebook reply which I'll repost here for posterity, and in case anyone else wants to weigh in on it...also, if I end up being wrong, you can forever link back to it to spite me. :P
No, I think Trump being elected and smashing your entire worldview and faith in America is more than punishment enough. :?
It seems no punishment is ever truly enough, is it? For what transgression, I don't even know.

EDIT: My FB mea culpa...
I wrote:
Well, it seems the only thing I've been right about for the past year (or several) was that, no matter what, things can ALWAYS get worse.

So the Trump worshipers have triumphed over both history and reason. They managed to successfully win an election with "Anyone But". They’ll soon find out exactly what they’ve done, though I doubt they’ll care. There is absolutely no reason for anyone to believe any of Trump’s campaign promises or policy pledges; the man is a congenital liar.

The conservative/Constitutionalist movement in America is officially without a political party or any representation in government, at least at the national level, and will be for at least a generation. The Republican Party is finished, they just don't know it yet. Trump will leave them in worse shape than Obama has left the Democrats. (See: Cults Of Personality Are Universally Bad.) Four years from now, the Marxist left will be back and stronger than ever, with a candidate that isn’t universally hated, and they’ll sweep the field and finish what Obama started. Those of you who think that sounds like a good thing will also find out that single-party rule isn’t quite what you’d imagined it would be.

Then again, what do I know? Not much, evidently. It seems we’ve entered a parallel universe where the laws of gravity and nature no longer apply, and we’ve been here for at least five years already.

So fuck it. I’m done with politics for the foreseeable future.

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Last edited by CWS on Wed Nov 09, 2016 5:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
For the record


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 9:12 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
Also, this totally sums up this entire election, from the primaries through to last night.

Image

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 3:20 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:24 am
Posts: 946
Location: Oregon, USA
Look on the bright side: With the Republicans holding the presidency, and majorities in both houses of Congress, we're going to be hearing a lot about how the rule of law is critical over the next few years.


And I can't be the only one who remembers how hard the Benghazi attack was downplayed leading up to the 2012 election, and how the FBI re-brought up Clinton's still-illegal classified information peddling in the past couple weeks. Considering the FBI had already let her off the hook for it "just because", someone dropped the ball somewhere...or perhaps, neglected to retain the ball handler.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 2:21 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
Sigh.......okay, bright side:
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
  • Maybe something will actually get done about ISIS.
  • Obamacare's days are (hopefully) numbered.
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
  • I am not a hypocrite, and I do not owe Bill Clinton an apology.
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
  • The "wall" probably won't get built, physically, but at least border security might become something that actually exists again.
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:44 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:24 am
Posts: 946
Location: Oregon, USA
CWS wrote:
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
...you know what? You're absolutely right. The actual bright side is right there.

I admit, I haven't been watching the election too closely so I missed a lot of the details on the wikileaks and whatever the first time around (also why I don't have a batch of links handy)....But a lot of the confirmed stuff is really telling, along with more publicly noted events. The supposedly-neutral DNC was backing Hillary all the back to before the first primary ever happened, the DNC and media went out of their way to suppress the other contender in the Democratic primary (Bernie Sanders), then-DNC-chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz was chastised for making a decision on a still-supposedly-neutral DNC convention without consulting Clinton's campaign manager and resigned over rigging the primary, Clinton made a point of specifically responding to Trump so he looked like the premier candidate, senior journalists submitted drafts to their articles to Clinton's campaign chair for review....

And she still lost. To Trump.

The collective minds of the American people cannot be bought. We know this now, we just watched the Democratic party and the media pool all the wealth and influence they could possibly muster, and they still came up short. Against Trump. Whether the aftermath of their failed tender offer is worth it is another matter entirely, but let's not forget that we just saw the pride of the entitlement establishment fall from the sky.

In the wise words of Mr. Torgue: ICARUS SYMBOLISM

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 12:19 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 6:31 am
Posts: 1054
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
CWS wrote:
Sigh.......okay, bright side:
[list][*]Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.


She was the lesser of two evils, no debate. But you are right to say that Hillary never having her claws on the Oval Office is undeniably a good thing.

CWS wrote:
[*]Maybe something will actually get done about ISIS.


You did hear what President Trump (gyeeuurgh... sorry, threw up a little) said about torturing family members, right? You're going to fight terrorism by... committing terrorism. :x Remind me who the bad guys are again?

Quote:
[*]Obamacare's days are (hopefully) numbered.


Replace it with something better, by all means. But with Republicans in control, I bet you every last cent I have for the next four years that you will revert back to the same, broken, twisted, horrifying abomination that existed before. Obamacare seems bad right now... well, it is compared to the far more competent systems in Europe, Australia, NZ and the rest of the civilised world. But I'd pick Obamacare over what you had eight years ago.

Quote:
[*]I am not a hypocrite, and I do not owe Bill Clinton an apology.


Fuck both the Clintons? Amen to that.

Quote:
[*]The "wall" probably won't get built, physically, but at least border security might become something that actually exists again.


What on earth are you talking about? You already spend fuckloads on border security. You have one of the most tightly controlled borders on Earth outside a demilitarised zone. And why do you care about Mexicans coming into the southern states? You live in North Dakota!

At any rate, physically patrolling your entire border going through plains, deserts, forests, towns, rivers and mountains would be impossible. The USA is simply too large. Most immigrants don't come in through the land borders anyway, they come in by plane, which a border wall will do sweet-fuck-all to stop. :lol:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 1:02 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:24 am
Posts: 946
Location: Oregon, USA
snowman1989 wrote:
But I'd pick Obamacare over what you had eight years ago.
You'd pick paying more for the same health care, being forced to pay for health care you don't need, or being fined for being unable to afford health insurance? :| Having seen insurance coverage both before and after Obamacare, I can assure you that by and large it's effectively a legion of rules that gives the government and insurance companies money, and generally penalizes citizens, for a medical infrastructure that's more or less the same as it was before.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:38 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
snowman1989 wrote:
Remind me who the bad guys are again?
Happy to oblige.
snowman1989 wrote:
What on earth are you talking about? You already spend fuckloads on border security. You have one of the most tightly controlled borders on Earth outside a demilitarised zone. And why do you care about Mexicans coming into the southern states? You live in North Dakota!

At any rate, physically patrolling your entire border going through plains, deserts, forests, towns, rivers and mountains would be impossible. The USA is simply too large. Most immigrants don't come in through the land borders anyway, they come in by plane, which a border wall will do sweet-fuck-all to stop. :lol:
Okay, this is just flat out ignorant.

Conservative estimates place the number of people living in the US illegally at over 11 million. That's over twice the population of your entire country, and the actual, current numbers are probably much higher. It is a massive, colossal problem that neither political party seems terribly interested in addressing, or worse, even encourages -- tacitly in the Republicans' case, and brazenly in the Democrats'. This is literally national and cultural suicide, no other country on the planet allows this kind of thing to go on like this. The problem is so bad that, yes, we DO see it this far north, but for the record, I care about it because it affects the entire nation, regardless of whether it impacts me personally. But I also understand that it will, in the future, and that it's something that will affect the lives of my niece(s) and nephew, not to mention the rest of my family and friends.

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 6:46 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 6:31 am
Posts: 1054
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
CWS wrote:
snowman1989 wrote:
Remind me who the bad guys are again?
Happy to oblige.


That was a rhetorical fucking question. Perhaps I should be blunt: If you torture civilians "even if it doesn't work," like Trump is proposing we do to ISIL family members, that makes YOU a fucking terrorist, you impossible prick.

Quote:
Conservative estimates place the number of people living in the US illegally at over 11 million. That's over twice the population of your entire country, and the actual, current numbers are probably much higher. It is a massive, colossal problem that neither political party seems terribly interested in addressing, or worse, even encourages -- tacitly in the Republicans' case, and brazenly in the Democrats'. This is literally national and cultural suicide, no other country on the planet allows this kind of thing to go on like this. The problem is so bad that, yes, we DO see it this far north, but for the record, I care about it because it affects the entire nation, regardless of whether it impacts me personally. But I also understand that it will, in the future, and that it's something that will affect the lives of my niece(s) and nephew, not to mention the rest of my family and friends.


I don't pretend to have answers, and I do see that the magnitude of the problem is vast. But one thing I do know is this: America is a nation built by immigration, by bringing in new people and encouraging them to persue their dreams and use their talents, free from the restrictions and endemic warfare of their homelands in Europe, or Africa, or Asia, or Latin America. Without it, America would be a far less populated place. You would not have become the workshop of the world. You would not enjoy world hegemony as you do today. You think America has always had white people, or black people, or Latinos?

New Zealand is very much the same, and we share some of the anxieties you do, though for us it's an increasing unease over the growing Asian population. There are fears that these people don't share our culture, our values or our way of life. I think we're thinking too little of them. They're coming here, both from immigration and naturalisation, clearly because they prefer to live here than China or India. I think they know what kind of lifestyle they think is preferable if they are choosing to come here. I'm not too worried.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:27 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
snowman1989 wrote:
That was a rhetorical fucking question. Perhaps I should be blunt: If you torture civilians "even if it doesn't work," like Trump is proposing we do to ISIL family members, that makes YOU a fucking terrorist, you impossible prick.
Do you get punched a lot? Like, by total strangers? Or is it mainly acquaintances? :roll:

What Trump said was incredibly stupid, and as I'm sure you're aware, I'm not about to defend any of that man's idiocy. The chances of that actually happening are also near zero. But even if it did, it would still be in no way comparable to the unrestrained, wholesale genocide ISIS has been carrying out non-stop in the territories they occupy.

In addendum, as you've pointed out many times, this isn't a war against "terrorism", as it has been erroneously labeled for the past fifteen years. Terrorism is a tactic, and an abhorrent one, which is why its practitioners are specifically excluded from the Geneva Conventions. But the actual war is against Islamic supremacists who believe they have the god-given right to torture, rape and murder anyone who does not subscribe to their salafist doctrine. Including (as should be obvious to everyone, at this point) other Muslims, not all of whom (again, obviously) are Islamic supremacists. Although the percentage of those who are is not a tiny minority, either, unfortunately.
snowman1989 wrote:
I don't pretend to have answers, and I do see that the magnitude of the problem is vast. But one thing I do know is this: America is a nation built by immigration, by bringing in new people and encouraging them to persue their dreams and use their talents, free from the restrictions and endemic warfare of their homelands in Europe, or Africa, or Asia, or Latin America. Without it, America would be a far less populated place. You would not have become the workshop of the world. You would not enjoy world hegemony as you do today.
What you're talking about is legal immigration, which is all well and good, and in fact something to be encouraged. Legal immigration is a monitored and regulated process, and those who go through it typically desire to assimilate into the society they are joining, which makes them "true" immigrants. Illegal immigration, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter, and should not even be described as "immigration" because it does not meet the definition I've just described, and which is a fairly universal one.
snowman1989 wrote:
New Zealand is very much the same, and we share some of the anxieties you do, though for us it's an increasing unease over the growing Asian population. There are fears that these people don't share our culture, our values or our way of life. I think we're thinking too little of them. They're coming here, both from immigration and naturalisation, clearly because they prefer to live here than China or India. I think they know what kind of lifestyle they think is preferable if they are choosing to come here. I'm not too worried.
Well, I hope you're right. The test will be whether they're willing to accept your laws, and agree that they're coming to live under a culture that is different from the one they've fled or abandoned, for whatever their reasons. That's not to say they must cast off every vestige of their cultural heritage, but it's not a good thing for anyone involved when little cultural enclaves and self-created ghettos start popping up within an existing country, as is increasingly occurring across Europe. And it should be understood that they will be required to abandon any aspects of their previous culture that are wholly incompatible with your existing laws and culture. That's not an unreasonable expectation for any country to have; neither is it a form of bigotry in and of itself, even if some may use it as an excuse for such.

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:37 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:24 am
Posts: 946
Location: Oregon, USA
snowman1989 wrote:
CWS wrote:
snowman1989 wrote:
Remind me who the bad guys are again?
Happy to oblige.
That was a rhetorical fucking question. Perhaps I should be blunt: If you torture civilians "even if it doesn't work," like Trump is proposing we do to ISIL family members, that makes YOU a fucking terrorist, you impossible prick.
Frankly, it's alarming how vigorously you insist that morons running off at the mouth about mass murderers, and mass murderers committing mass murder, are equivalent.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 5:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 6:31 am
Posts: 1054
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
The Phiend wrote:
Frankly, it's alarming how vigorously you insist that morons running off at the mouth about mass murderers, and mass murderers committing mass murder, are equivalent.


It's crucially important that we call these morons out so that they DON'T become equivalent. Violence, or the threat of violence, to advance a political goal is the textbook definition of terrorism.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Obligatory Poll: U.S. Presidential Election 2016
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 10:12 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:17 am
Posts: 3244
Location: NoDak, U.S.A.
CWS wrote:
Sigh.......okay, bright side:
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
  • Maybe something will actually get done about ISIS.
  • Obamacare's days are (hopefully) numbered.
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
  • I am not a hypocrite, and I do not owe Bill Clinton an apology.
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.
  • The "wall" probably won't get built, physically, but at least border security might become something that actually exists again.
  • Hillary Clinton will never be President of the United States.

Hey look, here's one more! :rbg:

_________________
Image
Image Image
Snow banner by Synkopated; Family banner by The Phiend


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 29 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Template made by DEVPPL